Episode 12
Jacques Went To China For Kyrie Irving's New Sneaker Launch
On this episode of Cars and Kicks, hosts Jacques, Nick, and Erik delve into the future of sneakers, focusing on ANTA's partnership with Kyrie Irving and the challenges the brand faces in the U.S. market. They discuss the quality of ANTA's products, the cultural perceptions surrounding Chinese goods, and the strategies needed for successful brand positioning. The conversation also touches on the upcoming Luftgekühlt Porsche event, highlighting the intersection of automotive culture and sneaker trends.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Cars and Kicks Podcast
03:51 Exploring ANTA and Kyrie's Journey
09:49 ANTA's Market Position and Challenges
16:04 Cultural Perceptions and Brand Identity
22:02 The Future of ANTA in the U.S. Market
27:58 Luftgekühlt Event and Closing Thoughts
All of the links you need: https://www.carsxkicks.com
The Cars and Kicks Show is hosted by:
Jacques Slade is a multifaceted creator that explores the world of footwear and sports through the lens of culture. Through sneakers and golf, Jacques has cultivated an industry leading voice in the industry that can be seen online and on television. Or he is just an idiot. The jury is still out on that.
Erik Valdez is a husband, father, actor, producer, and creator, whose passion and knowledge for cars is unmatched. You might have seen him on shows like General Hospital, Graceland, or Superman & Lois. He’s driven in the Continental Tire SportsCar Challenge, the Baja 1000, and the number of cars he’s owned would rival the how collections of many sneakerheads.
Nick Engvall is a consultant and creator who helps brands make more authentic connections with their customers. His obsession with cars and sneakers both toe the line of unhealthiness that is best described as, overly passionate. If he’s not recording podcasts, he’s probably at the burrito shop or chasing down ocean sunsets.
Transcript
Am I going? Are you going? I thought we, I'm going. I got, it's you, Hugh, you. Welcome to the podcast, people. I'm Jacques Slade. My man Nick's here. My man Eric's here. This is Cars and Kicks where we talk about, surprisingly, cars and kicks. And this week is all about the future, both in sneakers. Yeah, this is a room, perfect sound effect. Yeah, that.
erik.valdez (:Who's the Spider -Man meme? Who's... you're going.
Nick (:You're going.
erik.valdez (:and kicks.
Jacques (:That's a, that's a, actually that's an interesting podcast episode, not that we would do it, but like where and who thought of those sounds and made those sounds our future sounds. Like who was.
erik.valdez (:You know what, that's, that is like the question that would come from a six year old. Like Enzo asked these questions that I have like no answer to. He's like, why is the word the, the word the? Like who made that word the? Bro, it's nine o 'clock, go to sleep. Like, so yeah, that is a good question.
Jacques (:That would be a really good episode, I think. And speaking of the future, like a lot of that I think is happening and coming from China. There's a lot of stuff happening there that I learned on my trip to China. So spoiler alert, went to China for a week with Kyrie and either Anta or as Kyrie pronounces it, Onta. So I'm not sure exactly which one it is.
erik.valdez (:You were just there.
erik.valdez (:You didn't get clarification?
Jacques (:They say it both ways when they're there. There's some people that say anta, some people, and Kyrie during his like fashion show was very in the anta phase of his experience. And so I'm like, I don't, do I call it anta? Do I call it anta? Yes, yes, yes. Which is wild. Anyway. the theme song. Darn it. Theme song. Yes.
erik.valdez (:Okay.
erik.valdez (:So it's like Rihanna versus Rihanna, right? Basically. Okay.
Nick (:Yeah. Yeah.
erik.valdez (:Well, hold up, hold up. Before you go, I've been working on a little something here. I'm not trying to steal your thunder. There's no lyrics to this, but given your history in hip hop and your MC skills, I wanted to see if you could come up with something off the dome like you do, but with a little beat.
Jacques (:Okay.
erik.valdez (:So, you know, no pressure. I'll give you a little hint. So I've been trying to write a lot lately and stuff, so I've been on a lo -fi kick. So if that tells you anything, see what you can do with this. You ready?
Jacques (:off the dome. my God, this is gonna be, this is.
Jacques (:Okay.
Jacques (:I hope so.
Jacques (:You gotta turn it up, I can barely hear it.
erik.valdez (:Start me up and I have phones.
Jacques (:Okay, turn me up, turn me up. See, this feels more like a spoken word thing. This feels like I would be like, cars and kicks, they go together, but they separate. Separate like the wind from the rain and the stars from the sky together, but separate cars and kicks. We've got your fix with Jacques, Eric, and Nick.
erik.valdez (:There it is. Let's the beat ride. Let it ride. it... I promise it's almost over. Here we go. Here we go. It's almost over.
Jacques (:There it is. Yeah.
That's good.
Nick (:That was...
Jacques (:That's good though.
erik.valdez (:All right, all right. That's our first collab on the opening. Way to go, off the dome, the spoken word. Yeah.
Nick (:It's pretty good. Yeah.
Jacques (:That's good. That's really good. I like that.
Nick (:Yeah.
Jacques (:I love that. Nicely done, nicely done, nicely done. Nicely done. Snaps, hand snaps, hand snaps, hand snaps. Yeah, yeah, that's a new star for the show. If you guys haven't been subscribed to us or liked or favorite or us or any of those things, you should probably go do all of those things. We'll do a proper version of this little speech at the end of the episode, but just wanted to put it up here up front in case you guys.
erik.valdez (:Wow, here we go, it's a new start for us.
erik.valdez (:You
Jacques (:We're thinking about it if you were already hooked. I mean between us rambling and the intro obviously you want to listen to what's about to happen So China, let's talk about China So I was over there with Kyrie and anta or anta for those that are in the sneaker world You know that Kyrie was having some challenges in his relationship with Nike they decided to split ways and While Kyrie was out looking for other deals. He wound up
erik.valdez (:Absolutely.
Talk about it.
Jacques (:signing with ANTA, which is a Chinese company. And I didn't know this, but they are a massive Chinese company. I mean, they own Fila, they own, I think it's N, Arcterix, Arcterix or whatever, Arterix. Yeah, they own them.
Nick (:Big. Yeah.
erik.valdez (:man, that's my jam. When I lived up in Canada, that's like all we wear up there because it rains so much. They do some dope gear. I didn't know that. That's awesome.
Jacques (:Yeah, they own a ton of different companies. They own Solomon, the sneaker company. Let me see, I'm trying to find their website. They own Wilson, the American brand Wilson. What else? What other company do they own? I'm trying to figure out. I don't know why I don't have all of this right in front of me. Obviously I knew.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
erik.valdez (:wow.
erik.valdez (:Wilson's big man they they they've been in like the tennis and the golf game for a long time
Jacques (:Yeah, they own, so they own Arc'teryx, they own Solomon, they own Wilson, they own Peak Performance, they own Atomic, they own, yeah, they own, the main company is called Amir Sports, and they also own, I think it's Devereaux, or Decentay. So they own just a ton of different brands, it's crazy.
erik.valdez (:The ski company. Wow.
Jacques (:I was thinking about it while I was there and I was like, wow, owning these companies positions them in a way to do to do things in the American market that I don't think people are really aware of that they can do from a tech standpoint, from a distribution standpoint, from a design standpoint. They have all of these like touch points, I guess you would say.
erik.valdez (:Mm
Jacques (:that position them to really make a dent on the American market. But the challenge I think they're going to face right off the jump is what kind of company are they going to be? And I'll explain. So it's like, they can be onto the Chinese company or they're gonna be onto and come to America and be an American company. And while I do think there is...
the American public has more grace for an authentically Chinese company. I don't know how much grace there is for an authentically Chinese company. Obviously the thing that they're gonna have to battle is all of the stereotypes about Chinese -made prod and stigmas about Chinese prod that is cheaply made.
erik.valdez (:Mm
erik.valdez (:Stigmas and yeah.
Jacques (:that it's gonna fall apart, that it's not very good materials, that it's inexpensive. And my experience, or at least the experience that was shown to me by the Onta team, is that it's the complete opposite. It's the quality of the things that they're doing is absolutely incredible. The sneakers are on par, are better than the sneakers that I can get from any brand here in America, especially the Kyrie stuff.
erik.valdez (:Wow.
Jacques (:they own their factories, is that alone puts them in a different atmosphere. They were able to turn the Kyrie stuff around in like eight months. And for those that are in the sneaker world, you know that that's generally 18 months for a sneaker to kind of come to life. So they were able to put it together and get it out within 18 months using the technology that they have, using their own factories, using the materials. And it's not like they're cutting any corners.
erik.valdez (:Mm
Nick (:Okay.
erik.valdez (:Wow.
Nick (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:Mm
Jacques (:Everything is on par with everything that you can get here. The other challenge that they face is they don't have a distinct brand or even like a brand design. So like a Nike shoe has a feel to it, an Adidas shoe, a New Balance shoe, they all have this.
erik.valdez (:Mm
Jacques (:like thing to them that makes them distinctly that shoe, even if you just saw that silhouette, you would go, that's a new belt. that's a, that's a night. that's a Jordan. Like, auntie doesn't have that. And I think part of the reason why they had that is cause they've never really had to do that yet. I think in, China, because that population is, reveres the American market so much, they've had to sort of just iterate.
erik.valdez (:Mm
Jacques (:on American silhouettes and they could sell those. So they make their version of an A6, their version of a Nike shoe, their version of a New Balance. And it would sell like hotcakes because it has that American sort of feel and flair to it. But it never felt like, this is aunt's shoe. And that's a challenge that they're going to face. And it's going to be.
It's going to be worked for them. Like the closest thing they have right now is the Kyrie stuff. which I imagine Kyrie and his team have kind of come in and given some direction in that and kind of help separate it. But even like the Kyrie shoe feels a little Nike ish with the look and feel of it of the previous stuff that's been in the Kyrie line. And, you know, maybe part of it is going to be time of people getting, getting used to ANTA and seeing the ANTA, the ANTA symbol and the ANTA trademarks and
erik.valdez (:Mm
Jacques (:Maybe that'll eventually get people to that place, but it's fascinating what they're doing over there. I mean, with all the companies that they own, they have a logistics company as well. I think they were at like 99 .79 or something percent on their, whatever their KPI is for the company. I mean, all automated machines, like there's people there, but everything is run by machines.
erik.valdez (:Wow.
Jacques (:Like there's these giant, I think it was like 10 story factory building that we were in and everything is like those, what is it? What movie was that? Whatever it was almost like, in the matrix, how like the, the, the machines were going up and picking things like that. That's what it felt like, but it was like these large machines going into the warehouse, grabbing stuff off of storage cells, bringing it back, putting it on a, on a, on a, on a belt and the belt was just like flying around. Everything had.
erik.valdez (:you
erik.valdez (:Yeah.
Jacques (:RFID tags or everything was scanned. They were telling us that when stuff comes from the factory, when it's packed at the factory, it's scanned what's in there and that's embedded into the RFID tag so that when it gets to the factory, like they don't have to open it and separate it because the RFID tag tells the machines what's inside of it. So if they need to pick a box that has a size seven in it, the machine knows, I can go to box three, four, two.
erik.valdez (:Wow.
Jacques (:It has a size seven in it, bring it down to the factory worker. He can open the box, take the seven out, close the box up. It knows that the size seven was taken out, put it back on the track and it goes back to be stored away again. It's, it was just absolutely mind blowing. Now I don't, I don't know if that's how things usually work. I haven't been inside of a lot of factories and inside of a lot of distribution centers, but the speed and the accuracy of the way things were going, I was just like, just blown.
away by it and ANTA owns that stack. So they basically own everything from distribution, design, and everything else. Now, the, the other thing I know rambling here and you guys feel free to hop in at any time if you guys have questions. But the other thing that they have is they don't understand the concept of footlocker and they don't understand the concept of JD sports.
Nick (:Yeah, that's crazy.
Jacques (:because they all of their shoes are sold inside of their stores. have all of it. They have their own store. There's an aunt to store everywhere. There's like hundreds of aunt to stores in China. They don't have to put their stuff in a foot locker. Cause if you want my stuff, you just come to my store is kind of the way they think it's basically it's John Donahoe's wet dream essentially is what they have going on. But
erik.valdez (:direct to consumer. Aha.
Nick (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:Hehehehehe
Jacques (:So like that's another model that they're going to have to get that they had to adjust to when it came here to the States. And it's fascinating. I'm very impressed by what they can do, but they have such a hard job to come back to to come to the U S and to really break into the U S market.
erik.valdez (:Well, see, this brings up, I mean, there's a whole lot of things that you mentioned that are fascinating to me, and it brings up a whole lot of separate tangents that I'll try to narrow down here. in general, the stigma that's attached to Chinese goods, to me, is ridiculous. Not everything, but a vast majority of things that we use day to day, our phones, our technological things, vast majority of those are made in China.
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:Guess where the vast majority of sneakers are made. Guess where the vast majority of automotive components and batteries and stuff are made. They have had manufacturing down to a science for a long time. And a lot of people don't realize that. I don't know what it is about America and having this thing against
Jacques (:Yes.
erik.valdez (:you know, especially China, but other countries manufacturing things and then somehow being subpar to what we're capable of doing. Not to knock American goods. I am all about buying American, you know, supporting American businesses all day long. But the reality is there are certain things that just couldn't get made if we didn't outsource due to costs, due to all sorts of things. And people don't understand that. So to me, that's that's it really just needs to be people need to be educated, I think, is what it comes down to for that.
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:In terms of the designs and stuff, you touched on them being fascinated with American culture and American design and stuff like that. I've seen a lot of that in the automotive world as well. It can work, to your point, against them because instead of having their own voice, their own look, their own etc., they try to mimic things. It was years ago, I think the company was Dongfang, I'm pronouncing that correctly.
They did an almost one to one version of the AMG Hummer. You know, the Hummer one, the H1 that was an American military vehicle. They did almost an exact replica of that over there. There's been other companies, BYD, who's a huge company, and they're going to be they're going to have a presence in America very soon. I can't remember land wind, I think. And all these guys had vehicles that if you put it right next to, say, a BMW X1.
Nick (:Mm -hmm.
Jacques (:Mmm.
Jacques (:very soon.
erik.valdez (:it looked very similar or the land win. can't remember the name of it, but they had very similar design influence. I don't want to go any further than that, but a lot of people feel like they almost replicated Land Rover's designs. you know, almost to the point of lawsuit type level stuff. So it's on one hand, they can create whatever it is. They can produce whatever they need to produce because they have the technology and the wherewithal. But in trying to
assimilate, I guess, to other parts of the world and fit in, they've lost their voice. And I feel like that's going to be, especially a company like ANTA that has the resources that it does. Everything you're telling me is insane. If they've got their own logistics company, manufacturing, et cetera, it sounds to like they need to invest in consulting and marketing, basically. And if they've got the funds to do that, it's a pretty simple process, you know, as long as they're willing to
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yes. Yes.
erik.valdez (:to accept the fact that they're going to have to change a few things internally to help find that voice, et cetera. I don't know, man. A lot of these things are, it's just, I'm going to let Nick talk a little bit because I too will go on a long tangent and not let him get word in edgewise. But Nick, you're nodding your head a lot here. So let's hear your side of things.
Nick (:Hahaha.
Nick (:I think you're, you're spot on with the, you know, just like the weird, we saw in a previous episode, right? When we talk about Hyundai, you know, not a Jap or not a Chinese company, but like Americans have just this offish nature towards it. And probably even more so in the last, you know, 10 years or whatever, because of just the political climate of the country where it's like, everything is triggering for people. And, know, to your point, like,
They've been doing this really long time. I'm sure that a lot of the people that are making anti successful in China are also people that were a part of, you know, leaning 10, 15 years ago when they started to, to, get things moving in the U S you know, they leaning was bigger at that point, you know? And I think the interesting thing about them coming to the U S is like, will they play in the U S space the way
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:The U S is set up to play with, you know, a footlocker or will they choose to just say, we're just going to do our own thing. And we're going to have our own stores and we're going to do it the way we know it works here in China and apply it to the U S because. Ultimately, they probably have, they probably have enough money if they own the full, you know, tech stack or whatever you want to call it, right? It's all vertically integrated. Then it probably doesn't cost them near as much to.
Jacques (:And yeah.
Nick (:actually, you know, bring all that together in the U S and we've got plenty of empty mall real estate that kids are still going to walk around or whatever. But I think like, you know, there's definitely something to be said about what Jacques said, where the design language doesn't have to be exactly, you know, tied together with everything, but because they're so all over the place, there's a lot of, there's a lot of things that
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:Take a little bit more convincing for a U S customer, right? Like the skate shoes that you guys saw over there. you know, that's not a shoe that skate shops in the U S are not going to say, Kyrie, let's put Kyrie shoe next to, you know, an actual skateboarder. Like it's, that's just not how it works here. Like skate shops are very skateboarder driven. You know, I talked about it in a previous episode, but I think the, the potential for it all and the potential for it to reshape.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:where we're headed with sneakers, especially, but even with cars, right? You know, it's, huge. It's a huge opportunity. And, I forget where, where I was listening to this. was basically kind of researching on the Tesla B Y D situation where like, you know, Tesla essentially invested in a bunch of, you know, manufacturing plants there in China.
And, you know, they're not selling, they're not selling cars. Now people want to buy the B Y D cars because they're so much cheaper there. And, you know, honestly, if we had access to them without all the crazy tariffs, people probably would buy those cars here. But the, know, like our economies are, tied together so closely that like, you know, when, things are great for us, things are usually great for China. And when things are slowing down for China, things are usually slowing down for us. But for some reason, we, as Americans don't think that.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
erik.valdez (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:And I think the one like kind of interesting outlier to this conversation of the way people have this offish nature, the flip side of that is somehow Japan, right? Japanese. Like products, whether it's cars or kicks or anything in between are all kind of like highly revered as like these, like, you know, yeah. And, and I do it, I'm definitely guilty of it. You know, like there are certain brands where I'm just like, man.
erik.valdez (:Yeah, they're put on pedestals. Yep.
Jacques (:Yeah. Yeah.
Nick (:whatever they do, like it's so much better than what I can get here. I'm, willing to pay the extra for that, but it's, it's really interesting to see the dynamic and how, you know, like here in America, we just have so many different, like our opinions are shaped so much, not by our own experiences, not by even people that we listen to. you know, like the people that are listening to us are not going to listen to this and be like, I'm to go check out an antishoo, right? You know? Yeah. Like.
Jacques (:Yep, yep.
erik.valdez (:and we give China a chance.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:They're just already the mind is already made up and I think the last thing as a size 13 where I will say about like Chinese brands just make big shoes for America like just make big shoes like it's so hard to find size 13 stuff. They've gotten better at it in last year or two, but for the longest time like like I couldn't get clay Thompson shoes even though know he wears like a 14 like they didn't make 13s for this market. So I think that's another shift, but it's also an easy thing when you own
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
That's funny.
Nick (:the whole thing, right? So things just a matter of time before they get that.
Jacques (:When you own the factory. Yep. Yep. That brings up, that brings up a lot of things. One BYD. I felt like I was expecting to see more BYD cars on the streets, but it was.
It wasn't as many as I thought it was. It was a mix of, was the two cities that we were in. were in Shimon and Shenyang. And there were a mix of like BYDs. You saw a lot of BYDs, but you also saw like mid tier to high end American cars. So it wasn't like you were seeing like Fords and Chevys. You were seeing like Audis, BMWs.
erik.valdez (:Right.
erik.valdez (:Buick sells more cars in China than they do in, I think, all the other countries combined. At least they did up to a couple years ago. Buick has, for whatever reason, they're massive in China. And that is like that mid -tier, somewhat luxurious American car, yeah.
Jacques (:wow.
Jacques (:That's amazing. Yeah, that.
Yeah, it was a lot of those on the streets. then like you saw like Chinese brands and then it was like the mid tier up sort of American brands. wasn't like the Chevy Bolt. Wasn't like I didn't see Chevy Bolts or like Honda Accords or anything like that. And maybe I was just in the wrong areas, but that's kind of was the feel like I saw Bentley's and Land Rovers and Audis and BMWs and stuff like that on the streets more than more than any anything else. And then as far as
Like what you were saying, Eric, about branding and marketing. I think that's the biggest hurdle they're going to have to get over. It's almost like they need to do a brand awareness campaign for like the next few years, just to get it ingrained into the American psyche that they can do high quality, that they do high quality, super dope stuff. Like I was, I had the same.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
Jacques (:thoughts and ideas like the Kyrie shoe came and I was like, okay, the shoe is cool. All right, I get it. They did. They did a nice shoe. You know, you can get it. You can get a nice shoe off. But then they sent some of the apparel and I was like, wow. Like this is, this is really nice. Like this is like top -notch quality, like done really well. The, the, the stitching is done well. The lines look good. It fits on the body, right? Like they just did really, really well. And then we went over there and saw the factories and all the testing that they were doing and
Then we saw like the Kyrie fashion show. It's like, okay, they're really pushing the boundaries of like, we can do anything that they can do in the States and probably do it better because they're coming to us to do that. In fact, they were talking about a boost and they were talking about like the foam that Nike and all these companies use, the cushioning. And they're like, yeah, they're like, yeah, we have the, we have a deal with the same companies that they use to make their phone.
erik.valdez (:The cushioning.
Jacques (:In fact, we had the deal before them because they're Chinese companies and they show us everything before they show it to Nike and before they show it to Adidas. So we have the same thing and they were talking about how boost is they have a better version of boost basically based on like the response period and the energy return and the thickness of the material and the durability of the material. And I'm just like, no one like
erik.valdez (:I was gonna say.
Jacques (:how, so how do you get that out to people? How do you get people to hear these stories? And I think Erica's right. It's gotta be some sort of brand awareness, get the people to understand who we are and what we do. It's almost like a Hyundai and like Genesis glow up sort of situation where they've got to show what they're doing, which also, you know, again, another point like that affects their pricing. They're concerned with
Nick (:Yeah.
Jacques (:how to price things here because they're like, yes, we can beat them on price for the same quality of products, but then we're setting a precedent and people think, it's cheap Chinese stuff. It's a cheap shoe. And there's like, can price it the same as Nike, but then people aren't gonna wanna buy it because they're like, why would I buy this Chinese brand when it's Nike? And so like they're.
erik.valdez (:within your setting of precedence.
erik.valdez (:It's a cheap shoot. Yeah, exactly.
erik.valdez (:So let me ask you this, did they, while you were there, were there any talks of any other athletes or influencers or anybody here in pop culture icons, et cetera, that they've been trying to collaborate with? Because I feel like, obviously, Kyrie is their first foray into that in American culture, but you're going to need a lot more Kyries in a lot of different departments if you're going to try to start selling things. Are there mentions of any signings or partnerships?
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:So they did mention that they're looking at a lot of different people here. They're really trying to find the right person and the right people to align themselves with. They're thinking of Kyrie is sort of like their Trojan horse into the US market in a sense. Like he's the guy that's hopefully gonna open some doors. They're obviously starting with basketball. And then that's another thing. They only do like basketball and running. They don't really do like.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
Jacques (:Lifestyle or sock they don't do any cleated shoes or anything like that It's it's very focused on like basketball running and like the life the lifestyle slant So I think they're they're gonna use Kyrie as like the again like the Trojan horse to get into the American market, but they want to do Running and get into the running space and get into the lifestyle space as well And I think Kyrie is gonna open some of those doors, but they've got to find I think they got to find somebody in entertainment. They've got to find
erik.valdez (:Hmm.
erik.valdez (:Yeah.
Jacques (:a female basketball player, they've got to find another big time basketball player, but you know, it's, it's, it's hard. I, I think if you go to ONTA, you have to be willing to put in some work. So they need to find people that I think are more design marketing sort of oriented or like those sorts of athletes and entertainers that are, that are a little more hands on as opposed to somebody that's like, I just want to be a brand ambassador. Like cut me a check.
erik.valdez (:Hands on.
erik.valdez (:Right.
Jacques (:kind of thing.
Nick (:So I'm going to play a little devil's advocate here. What if, what if we look at this a little bit differently because. And has already had, they had Kevin Garnett for six or seven years, at least when he was with the Celtics and to the end of his career, almost that didn't do anything for them here in the U S but I personally don't think Kyrie is at the stage of his career that he's going to be the guy that like opens up the American market to, you know, anti selling shoes.
Jacques (:Right.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
Nick (:At a high level, he'll sell some for sure. But like, what if they don't even need to come to the U S I mean, granted, yes, they're going to want to grow and they want to expand. And the U S is a huge market for sneakers and for all the brands that they own. But it doesn't seem like the return on that. If they partner with a foot locker where they're going to have to mark down shoes to, you know, 40 % so they can leave foot locker room to grow or to profit. It's almost like.
I think the strategy would be to not come to the U S as anti as heavily. And actually to your point Jacques, like rebrand it as like, you know, from the minds of Fila Solomon and Arc'teryx, here's this new brand. And all of a sudden you have all this crazy new stuff. You can charge a premium for it. And that might be a way to make it interesting because I don't know. Like even, even if you take.
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
Nick (:like just based on, on previous, you know, like leaning with Baron Davis when he had his signature line for a few years, put a bunch of money in jumped in with foot locker. You know, this is like 2009 or something. Like I got to the first time I ever shot courtside at an NBA game. Like was at that launch of that shoe for the Clippers and everybody was into it. Like so many people were into him at that moment. Cause he was like,
three, four years into the league, was just top of his of his game. But like it fell off so quickly and then the shoes didn't sell at Footlocker. So they basically pulled right back out and then, you know, like reset five, six years later with Dwayne Wade jumping on board. But like it's almost like it's almost like you're you're
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:Dwayne Wade, yeah, I was gonna say.
Nick (:without like some major, major change to the branding or to the storyline. I don't know if it, if it, if it's even worth trying to go down that path in the sense that, that, you know, we would traditionally think of it now, maybe if they open their own stores, you take away that, know, like you're keeping an extra 30, 40 % on every pair, which means even at worst you can sell them for, you know, 60 % off and make tons of money on them. But
erik.valdez (:Here's where my mind goes with this and it's in line with a lot of what you're saying there, Nick. So I guess my initial question, the first part of what I'm thinking here is, do they take the almost like the Skechers route and white label a whole bunch of stuff? Because people don't even realize that. Like Skechers, think they are the largest sneaker manufacturer in the US, right? Like there's a whole bunch of companies that they manufacture for that nobody even realizes they do. Like, could you take that approach?
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:come here, white label a whole bunch of new brands. I mean, and maybe even don't say, you know, from the minds of Fila and Solomon and stuff like that, just start from scratch. Partner with the right athletes, the right influencers, et cetera, and create a brand out of nowhere. White label that or brands out of nowhere. White label that. And then years down the road, be like, by the way, ANSA has been doing this, this, and this, and have that be their signature line or something like that. That's one approach that comes to mind. The other thought is if they did go,
the route of opening their own stores. They don't want to deal with the Footlockers and the JD Sports and this and that. I think if you go that route, you really have to spend a lot of money on the customer experience. Right. So like if you go into an artteric store, since they own that brand, very high end. Like, you know that you walk in there, the staff that they hire, the graphics on the wall, the building itself from an architectural standpoint outside. As soon as you lay eyes on that, you're like, this isn't going to this is going to cost me a lot of money walking in the store.
So if you have that wow factor and you create a customer experience like that or like a Canada Goose or like, you know, one of these, they do sell in other stores here and there, know, Artterix and Canada Goose selling like Neiman Marcus and Nordstrom and stuff like that. But if you wanted to start with your own standalone stores, if they want to go that route, I think the customer experience has to be so top notch and over the top that it grips people from the get go because you only get one shot at that.
Nick (:Yeah. Super wow factor. Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:So, Anta, if you're listening and you want to hire some consultants, there are three of us right here, right now, that are willing to go to work for you.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:You
Jacques (:Ahahahaha!
Jacques (:Yeah. And I'll say, yeah, we got to go into their store. It essentially looks like a Nike store. It looks like a giant Nike store. Super nice, very well laid out, very well lit product is on display. It looks like a nice Nike, almost like a Nike town, a nice Nike store. I think we went in, we saw three different.
Nick (:Jacques, did you get to go into stores?
Nick (:Mm
Jacques (:stores and they all look like nice, like basically looking nice. And they have, they actually have three different tiers of stores. have like a premium store and they have like a, almost like a tier zero sort of store that we didn't get a chance to see. So they have different levels of stores and like, they have like ones that are like inside malls, ones that are standalone and stuff like that. So they have that. but to get to a couple of things you guys were talking about, I think the U S market.
I think they are going to go the distributor route as opposed to go to like the retail route. think they'll eventually want to get to retail, but like they're using like sneaker politics. Now they're using nice kicks, the nice kick store for their, for their product launches. So they're using those places to sell shoes now. And I think they're going to start getting actually getting apparel inside of those as well, which, which will be great. Cause people get a chance to be like, what is this? this.
This is like nice quality. And if it like fits the design trends at the moment, I think that'll start opening up some of those, some of those doors. I'm, I guess, cautiously optimistic based on everything that I've seen. Robbie Fuller is there. I don't know if you remember Robbie Fuller, Nick. yeah, so he's there. He's at, he's at, he's at until he's been there. I believe he said for six years and you know, he,
Nick (:yeah, nice.
Nick (:Yeah, cool. I didn't realize he was still there.
Jacques (:I had a chance to talk to him for a little while and he's like, it's an uphill battle just to kind of change the way people think about things, especially when it comes to the American market. He's like, but we're making like amazing strides and we're doing incredible, incredible things. And he was really bragging about the tech and he was like, no, he's like, I got it. got everything I need. I have it. Like I can outdo anybody at any of those companies right now with the stuff that we have.
erik.valdez (:Wow.
Jacques (:which is amazing. I would just like talk, talk your shit, Robbie. I love it. You love, you love to hear it. But it looks, their stuff looks good, man. Even the stuff that feels iterative, like you pick it up and you get it in your hand and you're like, okay. Like I get it. You guys are, you guys are legit.
Nick (:Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
erik.valdez (:I mean, and some of the technology that you were sharing with me just via text, and I think you posted some of it on your feed and stuff too, is kind of out of this world. You we alluded to that a few episodes ago. We actually talked about it on a couple of podcasts where that's been the thing that there's been a stagnation in the technological side of sneakers and the advancement in that. And some of the stuff you were showing me with like these carbon rods that move, you know, based on foot placement and stuff like that. Like, I think if you have a combination of
Nick (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:technology that is novel, that nobody's seen before, and a great customer experience, that's a great foot to start on if you're gonna try to really just launch hard here in the United States. and you know, who knows? Like, again, Nick was talking about just the political climate and how polarized everyone is in this country and stuff, and it is a difficult time to start. You mentioned Japanese companies. back in the, I guess, when did Toyota
first come into the United States. It would have been late 60s there thereabouts. And at that point, there was some animosity in this country from World War II left over with Japan. So it was a slow burn for people to accept Toyota as a legitimate manufacturer in this country. And now look at them and the success they've had and the other brands that they've launched, the sub -brands, et cetera. And so it sounds like...
Nick (:70s yeah.
erik.valdez (:They, know, ANTA has the wherewithal to ride this out as long as they need to. But of course, everybody wants to find the fastest route possible. So we'll see how it goes from there. But we can talk about this a whole lot longer. You know, there's a couple of other things I wanted to get to on the pod before we run out of time. And one of those in this complete non sequitur, but I'm going to try to link this together somehow in the world of maybe starting something from nothing and seeing it grow into something successful. And that is.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Hahaha
erik.valdez (:Look how I'm gonna tie this together. Liftgacult10 is coming to LA on Saturday, October 5th. And that is something that we will be attending. Breaking news, we'll be out there. I don't know if Jacques, he might not be able to break away. I hear it's his anniversary, so I don't know if the wife's gonna want him hanging out with a bunch of dudes at a Porsche show. But we'll see. We'll see, we'll see. Nick and I will be walking around there for sure.
Jacques (:There you go.
Jacques (:Breaking news.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:We'll see, we'll see, you know what saying?
Nick (:I mean, you could just solve that by buying her.
erik.valdez (:That's, there you go. That's.
Jacques (:I don't have I don't have I Don't have Eric. I don't have Eric money. I don't know who you think I am
Nick (:backseat, right? It's practical.
erik.valdez (:think that's a great idea.
erik.valdez (:Eric doesn't have Eric money from two years ago right now either. but no, that is, that's exciting. know, Nick's coming down from Monterey. We're kind of converging on LA. That's Jacques' hometown. I lived there for years, but I'm coming out, Nick's coming out. We're to be walking around, checking things out, just kind of being guests, but also, you who knows what we'll capture there and who we'll get to talk to while we're there. But that, you know, it's exciting. This did come from...
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:It was the brain child of Patrick Long and a couple of other partners. It's all Patrick's now. He's, for those that don't know Patrick, is an American race car driver who's raced for the Porsche factory team for years. Extremely successful. And this was an idea that started a long time ago, basically saying, there's cars and coffees and there's car shows and stuff, but what if we did this really cool high -end event centered around the world of very cool Porsches?
and Luftgekult was born. don't even know if I'm saying that right. It's been around 10 years. I may be mispronouncing that, but it is going to be their 10th anniversary. It is going to be at the Universal Studios Backlot, which is they've done it there before and it's an incredible setting. You're going to have, you know, for those that I've been lucky enough to work on back lots my whole career and it still doesn't get old when you walk onto like a
Fake street or or something like that It's just it's such a cool experience and for those that have never set foot on a back lot to be able to do that and Have that as the backdrop to some of the rarest Porsches in the world It's an experience man. So if shouts out to Pat and all those guys putting this on and if you are in LA This coming weekend October 5th, then you'll have to go out there and check that out and come say hi to us if you see us
Nick (:Absolutely.
Jacques (:Yeah, I don't know if I'm gonna be there, but either way, I know it's gonna be dope and I'm a little disappointed. I shouldn't say disappointed. I have other plans, but it would be great to go, especially because I'm so into cars and this is such my world. You know I mean?
erik.valdez (:Jacques has been an Eric old Porsche fan for a long time, right? know, since the G bodies, right?
Jacques (:Yeah, gosh. Yeah, it's been a while.
That I was G. Was it the G? Huh? I just got it's just been I don't it's been a while. I don't remember. I don't remember which one it was. It's been it's been a minute, but that it that's that sounds super cool. And I'm glad you guys are gonna you guys are gonna get to go. can't wait to see like what you guys capture while you're there and the people you guys get to get to talk to. I think it's gonna be super dope. It's gonna be super dope.
erik.valdez (:Or is it, did you come in the 964 era or maybe 993?
You
erik.valdez (:Super. Look, y 'all can't see Nick smile unless you're watching this on the YouTubes or the Spotify's, I think Nick is, he's speechless, he's so excited.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:Yeah, I'm stoked. I mean, the back lot, the back lot, I didn't get to go when they did this. I think it was six and I didn't get to go and probably one of the biggest cases of FOMO I've ever experienced in my life after I saw the photos because it's just one of those things where it's completely different to your point about cars and coffee, right? Like I get excited to go to cars and coffee yet. Like
Jacques (:glowing.
erik.valdez (:I think it was. Yeah.
Jacques (:Hahaha!
Nick (:I mean, it doesn't matter if it's an Applebee's cars and coffee. I'm in right. Like I just want to go connect with people and see people's stuff and hear their stories. But when you, when you're able to do this in a way that it's like, there's such a wow factor. I think that, you know, he's. Lusical and you know, the air water show in Orange County. went to that and it was like, just to put these cars in these settings that you just don't get to see, you know, it's like,
Jacques (:Right, right.
Nick (:You just as a consumer, you don't get to see behind the curtain like that, right? You don't get to see these incredible photo shoots that are that are done even even like we talked about on car week, you know, so many cars are here for car week in Monterey and brands absolutely shoot like Days or weeks worth of content so they can keep posting. Hey, we're up in the hills You know above the ocean and I see photos get posted almost every day where I'm like, yep. They definitely took that one
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Nick (:during car week, like that car was out here during car week. And of course, every photographer wants to take those photos because it's a perfect setting, you know, to have those. But to be able to experience that as a consumer and be like, you're you're right here. Like the backdrop is here, the, know, the streets, the, you know, where else are you going to, you know, take a picture of a portion directly in front of the White House? You know, those types of things happen in this kind of like, fake world that like normally
Jacques (:Hahaha
erik.valdez (:Mm -hmm.
Jacques (:Right, yeah.
Nick (:You know, the average person doesn't get access to. yeah, I'm, really excited for it. I can't wait. And hopefully we get to meet some people out there too.
erik.valdez (:Yeah, mean, for those that haven't been, it's more of a curated art exhibit than a car show, the way that they put these things together. And you you mentioned the photography that takes place there. Jeff's Ward has been a part of this. He's been around since the beginning. again, for those that don't know, his Ward accomplished, very accomplished race car drivers, you know, gone up Pike's Peak, I don't know how many times and how many, I don't know how many different iterations of 911s is one of the best photographers, automotive photographers in the world.
Worked with Porsche back in the day on some of their ad campaigns where you know these these really the one I remember was a thing it was a 964 turbo Jumping, you know, it was like all four wheels off the ground black and white poster type photo with some text below it or whatever and so he's been a part of that Porsche family for a long time and that in and of itself to have a Manufacturer involved in something like this is is big anyway to have Porsche kind of sign off on it
Nick (:Yeah.
Jacques (:That's it.
erik.valdez (:is huge because they're very selective with who they work with. so, you know, again, I would love to get Pat on the show and talk about how this all came to be. I know bits and pieces of the story because I was there from day one and, you know, it would be great to pick his brain and kind of hear what the pitch was. Like, you know, here's this American Porsche driver and, you know, what does he do? Does he go to Porsche and be like, hey, guys.
I've won a lot of races for you. Here's an idea I had. Can we do this? Or, you know, is it more involved? But I hope we get to, we'll get to talk to him a bit while we're there. Hopefully we get him on the pod, you know, down the road and maybe talk a bit about the 10 years, because it is such a cool experience.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:That sounds so sick now. I'm getting now I'm getting FOMO, but I know you guys I know you guys will knock it out the park So just just get a couple of interviews and I think it's just you know, take in the ambiance and enjoy It's gonna be crazy
erik.valdez (:We'll just use an AI generated version of Jacques in whatever we do. post it in there. Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah, yeah, there's AI Jacques. I might only have four fingers or something like that in the AI version, but you know, we'll make it work.
erik.valdez (:But awesome. Well, you know, we could talk about a whole bunch of other things. I think after we visit Luft, there will be the other events around it in LA. It'll make for great topics for the next episode or the one after that. But probably time to wrap things up, let you all get on with your lives. And man, it was cool to hear about your experience there in China, Jacques. Just again, I know we talked a little bit here and there while you were there, but.
Jacques (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:We're gonna have to follow that story a bit with ANTA and ANTA and figure out where they're going with things and figure out how to pronounce it, know, first and foremost. Yeah, maybe we'll work on the intro, you know, go down a different road on the production and, you know, we got a lot of things in the works here for y 'all. So thank you.
Jacques (:Yeah.
Jacques (:That part, that part, yeah, that part too.
Nick (:Right. Yes. Yeah.
Jacques (:Yeah, the next episode intro is gonna be crazy. Cause I got something. I got something. I got something. I was ready to unleash it for you guys today, but you we had some spot naity happening. So next week is gonna be popping. It's gonna be popping.
erik.valdez (:man. man.
erik.valdez (:All right, all right.
Nick (:Actually, you know what too, I forgot to mention this. There is a review on iTunes or Apple Podcasts rather with some suggestions for an intro for you to consider as well Jacques. yep, yep, check it out. And if you haven't left us a review, definitely leave us a review on Apple too and tell Jacques, yeah.
Jacques (:really? All right. I'm going to have to is on Apple. OK, I'll go check it out.
erik.valdez (:Yeah.
erik.valdez (:People are speaking.
Jacques (:You heard the man, you heard the man.
erik.valdez (:We love it, man. We love y 'all's enthusiasm. We love the reviews. If you're listening for the first time, go leave us a review, follow, subscribe, all of those things. I'm taking Jacques's job. He usually wraps up the show, but I don't know. I just roll with it right now. So Jacques, you want to finish it off?
Jacques (:I love it.
Jacques (:No, you're good, you're good. No, no, I'm just saying I'm Jacques Slade.
erik.valdez (:I'm Erik Valdez and there here's the Spider -Man me there he is thank y 'all for tuning in today we'll talk to y 'all soon
Jacques (:Yeah
Nick (:I'm Nick Engvall.
Nick (:Peace.
